2018 Year Summary: Who was converted?

Most pro-ID or pro-evolution blogs have summaries of the year usually with the highlights of the most interesting points or OPs …Larry Moran also has one on the most popular post though of 2017…

If I were in charge of a blog like TSZ my summary of 2018 would ask for the details of the actual conversions: i.e. how effective TSZ has been in what it was set up for. It was apparently set up to attract converts from the support or belief of ID to support or believe that sheer dumb luck in the discussions of life origins…

While some kind of survey would be also helpful, this OP could also help to set up such a survey with the actual data and more details…

So, feel free to comment with details about what effect the OPs in 2018 at TSZ have had on your world views in the debate of the origins involving ID vs Evolution (sheer dumb luck).

For example, over the last year, I have been converted from the belief that evolution could still be considered as a scientific hypothesis to total absurdity due to the lack of any experimental evidence supporting it… The total lack of even the proposals how to set up few relatively simple experiments have proven to me that evolutionary theory has nothing to do with science and everything to do with ideology…

What about you? Have you been converted?

104 thoughts on “2018 Year Summary: Who was converted?

  1. If you go to “About This Site” and read what it says, it says nothing about conversion being a goal.

  2. Fair Witness:
    If you go to “About This Site” and read what it says,it says nothing about conversion being a goal.

    This means you have nothing to comment about this OP…
    Nothing new…
    Converts usaully are the ones who are not affraid to look beyond their beliefs…

  3. Well Alan Fox has converted to Ashkenazim.

    And I hear DNA Jock is considering converting to Mongolian. He is changing his name to Nergui. He often rubs charcoal on his head when he goes out so the spirits will think he is a rabbit.

  4. I have converted.

    I used to think that after a million times correcting someone’s mischaracterization of evolution as “sheer-dumb-luck,” the person would finally understand how stupid that kind of chant makes them look.

    Now I’m convinced that some people will never be able to realize how imbecilic and uneducable that makes them sound. How obvious it becomes that their problem is lack of mental abilities. How obvious it becomes that understanding might be beyond their capabilities. Now I accept that they just won’t even try and understand their problem, because they really have no clue.

    Now I’m convinced that people can be that obtuse and still maintain an arrogant tone. Stupid and arrogant is all they’ll show themselves to be, yet they’ll never realize.

    Sad. but I have to accept that’s the way it is.

  5. For example, over the last year, I have been converted from the belief that evolution could still be considered as a scientific hypothesis to total absurdity due to the lack of any experimental evidence supporting it

    You have posts going back at least to 2012 on Larry Moran’s blog saying the same stupid shit you’ve always been saying. There’s zero evidence that you’ve changed your views on any position for the last 6-7 years. Nobody buys your nonsense but those who want to. You don’t even believe it yourself, c’mon stop bullshitting.

  6. Let’s see

    Entropy:
    I have converted.

    I used to think that after a million times correcting someone’s mischaracterization of evolution as “sheer-dumb-luck,” the person would finally understand how stupid that kind of chant makes them look.

    Now I’m convinced that some people will never be able to realize how imbecilic and uneducable that makes them sound. How obvious it becomes that their problem is lack of mental abilities. How obvious it becomes that understanding might be beyond their capabilities. Now I accept that they just won’t even try and understand their problem, because they really have no clue.

    Now I’m convinced that people can be that obtuse and still maintain an arrogant tone. Stupid and arrogant is all they’ll show themselves to be, yet they’ll never realize.

    Sad. but I have to accept that’s the way it is.

    Pardon me! Entropy likes to hide sheer dumb luck behind the creative powers of natural processes… I guess it sounds more scientific…
    But if natural processes have such creative abilities so as to turn a 5 pound land walking mammal into a 50 ton whale their creative abilities surely can be tested on the much smaller scale… With 10 billion species on earth apparently evolving there should be a way to tweak the genes to show that they can do what their believers hope they can…
    Unfortunately…so far… nothing new has been accomplished other than by intelligent, selective breeding, which involves the breaking or downgrading the functions of genes …No new body plans…not even some hope of seeing one…
    That’s why the believers in natural processes require to have much greater faith than believers in ID or God… They are required to believe in the creative omnipotence of natural processes, which surpasse thier intelligence pushing their faith beyond any imaginable limits…

  7. What I could never understand is why so many here at TSZ never apply this ancient rule:
    ” We should follow the argument wherever it may lead”…rather than ‘we should follow the argument wherever we want it to lead’…

  8. Entropy: I used to think that after a million times correcting someone’s mischaracterization of evolution as “sheer-dumb-luck,” the person would finally understand how stupid that kind of chant makes them look.

    Now I’m convinced that some people will never be able to realize how imbecilic and uneducable that makes them sound. How obvious it becomes that their problem is lack of mental abilities. How obvious it becomes that understanding might be beyond their capabilities. Now I accept that they just won’t even try and understand their problem, because they really have no clue.

    Now I’m convinced that people can be that obtuse and still maintain an arrogant tone. Stupid and arrogant is all they’ll show themselves to be, yet they’ll never realize.

    As the old joke goes, “I used to believe that people would change their beliefs when confronted with evidence, but now I’m confronted with evidence that they don’t.”

  9. Kantian Naturalist,

    I am now convinced that people can be that obtuse and still maintain an arrogant tone. Stupid and arrogant is all they’ll show themselves to be, yet they’ll never realize.

    Now I’m convinced that some people will never be able to realize how imbecilic and uneducable that makes them sound. How obvious it becomes that their problem is lack of mental abilities. How obvious it becomes that understanding might be beyond their capabilities. Now I accept that they just won’t even try and understand their problem, because they really have no clue.

    SOME people just too imbecilic. Its they lack mental abilities. I am not saying its ALL atheists, or even all atheist moderators. Just some. Some.

  10. J-Mac:
    What I could never understand is why so many here at TSZ never apply this ancient rule:
    ” We should follow the argument wherever it may lead”…rather than ‘we shouldfollow the argument wherever we want it to lead’…

    Mystifying. When (for example) a mountain of evidence points to Common Descent, what do you do? Deny, deny, deny. Because it doesn’t lead where you want it to lead.

  11. The deep and abiding human warmth of the resident Christians, though … a fine advert for their religion. I nearly signed up.

  12. It was apparently set up to attract converts from the support or belief of ID to support or believe that sheer dumb luck in the discussions of life origins…

    When one starts off with an absurdly false premise like that one, it’s hardly a surprise that the rest is all bullshit too. Yet another pointless OP based on a complete failure to comprehend basic facts. It’s a good thing that the Rules don’t prohibit us from banning anyone who abuses authorial privileges.

  13. Allan Miller: The deep and abiding human warmth of the resident Christians, though … a fine advert for their religion. I nearly signed up.

    There are no Christians at TSZ.

  14. Allan Miller: No true ones?

    Let’s just say that there are two kinds of Christians: those that Nietzsche was right about and those that Nietzsche was wrong about. The ones at TSZ are the kind that Nietzsche was right about.

  15. Kantian Naturalist: When one starts off with an absurdly false premise like that one, it’s hardly a surprise that the rest is all bullshit too. Yet another pointless OP based on a complete failure to comprehend basic facts. It’s a good thing that the Rules don’t prohibit us from banning anyone who abuses authorial privileges.

    I could have built my OP on “the true premise” of abiogenesis… I just didn’t want to make the true atheists here look like complete fools…though I have noticed that some of them lean towards the true scientific theory of the life creative powers of thermo-vents so evangelized by Rum and his followers… out of pure desperation…

  16. Kantian Naturalist: Let’s just say that there are two kinds of Christians: those that Nietzsche was right about and those that Nietzsche was wrong about. The ones at TSZ are the kind that Nietzsche was right about.

    He could have been wrong about both…

  17. I’m with J-Mac on this one. How can anyone believe in an ideologically disallowed process despite enormous demonstrated evidence, when the alternative of sheer divine magic is so much more compelling. Just consider that scientific interpretations always run the risk of being incorrect or incomplete, while magic can’t be. Wouldn’t people rather be absolutely right beyond any need to think, than probably right but possibly wrong? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

  18. I recently converted to Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region (Council of 1912).

  19. quarrion:
    I recently converted to Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region (Council of 1912).

    Die, heretic!

  20. Flint:
    I’m with J-Mac on this one. How can anyone believe in an ideologically disallowed process despite enormous demonstrated evidence, when the alternative of sheer divine magic is so much more compelling. Just consider that scientific interpretations always run the risk of being incorrect or incomplete, while magic can’t be. Wouldn’t people rather be absolutely right beyond any need to think, than probably right but possibly wrong? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

    It takes a lot of faith to be a Darwinist and even more so to be an Atheist…
    I don’t have it that’s why l am a deist…

  21. Flint: when the alternative of sheer divine magic is so much more compelling

    Don’t forget about the quantum!

  22. J-Mac: He could have been wrong about both…

    Then there are still only two kinds of Christians, the kind he thought existed and all the rest..

  23. newton: Then there are still only two kinds of Christians, the kind he thought existed and all the rest..

    Is that why Nietzsche came to the conclusion that Christian God was dead?

  24. J-Mac: It takes a lot of faith to be a Darwinist and even more so to be an Atheist…
    I don’t have it that’s why l am a deist…

    Oh, I agree. Faith is easy when evidence is irrelevant. Why struggle to have faith in something that might not be Absolutely True, forced to consider and then reject all the evidence, when you can be comfortable and secure without any such hassle? Your approach has all the advantages and none of the problems.

  25. newton: How did the designer create life?

    It had to be in the top dow manner since the bottom up has not been accomplished because it can’t be…Whoever created life He had to have the insight into matter on the subatomic level; quantum or even below….I know this because of the law of conservation of quantum information… Is the difference between inanimate and animate matter just the arraignment of quantum states? I doubt it…there has to be more possibly dark energy…same one that causes the universe’s expansion to accelerate and creating spacetime as we speak…

  26. Flint: Oh, I agree. Faith is easy when evidence is irrelevant. Why struggle to have faith in something that might not be Absolutely True, forced to consider and then reject all the evidence, when you can be comfortable and secure without any such hassle? Your approach has all the advantages and none of the problems.

    There is a difference between blind faith and the faith that is based on evidence…
    On what evidence is the faith in abiogenesis based on? Give us a few pieces of real evidence that life could have arisen spontaneously…You have faith in abiogenesis based on some evidence, don’t you?

  27. J-Mac: You’re calling speculative fiction research? I’ve asked for evidence and not wishful thinking…Can you tell the difference?

    I can tell the difference between evidence that supports my beliefs and evidence that doesn’t. In all my time here I have yet to see any indication that you can do the same. Since I am unable to maintain the pretense that I believe you to be arguing in good faith, I shall withdraw from this conversation.

  28. The main property of an animate matter vs inanimate is in life the information flows in two directions… The two way information flow in life can not be resolved by any type of abiogenesis or gradual steps of evolution…

    This undeniable fact is the bases of my faith that life had to be created in top to bottom way…

  29. Kantian Naturalist: I can tell the difference between evidence that supports my beliefs and evidence that doesn’t. In all my time here I have yet to see any indication that you can do the same. Since I am unable to maintain the pretense that I believe you to be arguing in good faith, I shall withdraw from this conversation.

    I don’t think you can… If you did, you wouldn’t me linking “research” that contradicts your very claim of evidence…
    You can still recover from your embarrassed state by pointing to 1 piece of evidence that supports abiogenesis…I say it’s not there…
    ETA: looks like Kantian needs help…can someone help him find 1 piece of evidence for abiogenesis? Unfortunately I can’t because I haven’t read it…but I’m sure it is not there…🤣
    Oh the mystery of faith…blind in this particular case…

  30. Kantian Naturalist: There are no Christians at TSZ.

    Phoodoo: Only Jews.

    Which brings us to the question again: What makes one a Christian?

  31. On conversion.
    If one side is right then the other side is wrong.
    So it should be, on a curve, that in intellectual discussion the RIGHT , by attrition, starts to beat down the wrong.
    So in these matters its a option its not like the American civil wars battles which changed things but like WWi with trench warfare. Eventually the wrong side was converted..
    Since these are scientific subjects, not like religion, there is a great attrition of accuracy on inaccuracy.
    Surely its happening here . Or it means the wrong guys are weirdly not reflective enough. I don’t think this is so.
    The reason i think ID/YEC does better here is because the opposition started with all the ground, resources, and notable personel.
    They are not doing as well as they should be.
    This because they are wrong and the Id/YEC/other critics are doing well relatively.
    As on TSZ also civilization. Modeern organized creationism is prevailing on a curve and I predict, in many details but not all, will have the revolution announced by all as successful.
    Everyone will be converted to many errors of God denialism in nature and evolutionism.

  32. Robert Byers said

    If one side is right then the other side is wrong.

    And from Fiddler On The Roof

    Townsperson: Why should I break my head about the outside world? Let the outside world break its own head….
    Tevye: He is right…
    Perchik: Nonsense. You can’t close your eyes to what’s happening in the world.
    Tevye: He’s right.
    Rabbi’s pupil: He’s right, and he’s right. They can’t both be right!
    Tevye: (Pause). You know, you are also right.

    So, Robert Byers, my friend: if my friend says 2 + 2 = 3 , and your friend says 2 + 2 = 5, if one of them is wrong, which one is right?

  33. quarrion: So, Robert Byers, my friend: if my friend says 2 + 2 = 3 , and your friend says 2 + 2 = 5, if one of them is wrong, which one is right?

    Taken on average, together they are exactly right.

  34. Entropy:
    I have converted.

    I used to think that after a million times correcting someone’s mischaracterization of evolution as “sheer-dumb-luck,” the person would finally understand how stupid that kind of chant makes them look.

    Now I’m convinced that some people will never be able to realize how imbecilic and uneducable that makes them sound. How obvious it becomes that their problem is lack of mental abilities. How obvious it becomes that understanding might be beyond their capabilities. Now I accept that they just won’t even try and understand their problem, because they really have no clue.

    Now I’m convinced that people can be that obtuse and still maintain an arrogant tone. Stupid and arrogant is all they’ll show themselves to be, yet they’ll never realize.

    Sad. but I have to accept that’s the way it is.

    Oy vey !

  35. J-Mac: Now replace Christians with Jews and see if the same comments make the same sense…

    But it’s not the Jews here who are exhibiting disproportionate amounts of misanthropic assholery, so why would I? I mean (whisper it) some Jews can be twats too, while many Christians achieve the standards to which they nominally aspire. It’s not about the entirety of either group, but an ironic prod at some.

  36. My original comment about ‘following the evidence where it leads’ was about common descent, not abiogeneisis. The evidence leads to a conclusion of common descent … doesn’t it?

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